Introduction
Good afternoon, Dave. How are you doing?
[Dave Matt]
Good afternoon, Richard. Thanks for having me on and congratulations on our Liverpool Championship last year. It’s not bad.
[Richard Bexon]
It’s looking pretty good this year as well, right?
[Dave Matt]
Looking excellent this year. You have impeccable taste and judgment in football clubs.
[Richard Bexon]
Liverpool Football Club, just in case we have any Manchester United or Everton supporters here on the podcast. New subscribers there, Dave, to be honest.
[Dave Matt]
Poor guys, those Man U Everton folk.
Current Costa Rica Real Estate Market Assessment
[Richard Bexon]
Awesome. It’s been a while since we’ve had you on the podcast, but I wanted to get kind of your perspective currently. How would you describe the investment and real estate market currently in Costa Rica?
[Dave Matt]
I will speak from my perspective because I’m developing a piece of land in the absolute most pristine, beautiful, best area of the country and the best beach on the planet, Junquial, and it’s a buyer’s market. That’s what I would say. It’s a good time to come with cash in hand.
I see from anywhere from just land and houses that buyers are working deals. Now, I think that in my neck of the woods, that’s probably somewhat specific to that area. I think there are some other more traditional tourist areas where that’s not the case, but where we are, it’s like, come ready and you can get yourself a little gem.
[Richard Bexon]
Yeah, I think I’d agree. I mean, I think if you’re off the beaten track a little bit, well, you just move outside those areas. I mean, if you’re going to Tamarindo or Flamingo, yeah, you’ll see a little bit of price improvement, but there’s still supply and demand there.
I mean, there’s still not a huge amount of supply in some of these areas and demand is still pretty strong. So you’ll see a little bit of movement, but not much, but yeah.
Why Junquillal Over Developed Areas
[Dave Matt]
Yeah. I tell you, the smart ones are getting out of Nosara and they’re getting out of Tamarindo and Flamingo and the smart ones, and they’re going to what Costa Rica sort of found its identity in, which is nature. Personally, what drew me to Costa Rica and the reason I fell in love with Costa Rica was not because I was surrounded by taxis and nightclubs or marinas with million dollar yachts, to be honest.
I want nature. I want the beach. I want to actually be able to walk on the beach with my wife at sunset and maybe not see anybody.
[Richard Bexon]
Yeah.
[Dave Matt]
I don’t think that’s too much to ask. That’s what we spent, my family and I, we spent a year in Costa Rica in 2009 and then been coming back ever since. And that’s really what we’ve found in Uncial is that serenity and that untouched beauty.
And yet we’ve got Bernardo’s beachfront bar and grill on the beach and we’ve got restaurants within striking distance. It’s remote and it’s peaceful, but it’s not isolated. So it’s epic.
[Richard Bexon]
But I think also you’ve got a great community there in Uncial as well. Oh my goodness.
[Dave Matt]
Yeah. Yeah. I tell you what, I’m a lifelong surfer.
I paddle out at, I guess I should probably edit myself, paddle out at a certain beach, not too far north of Uncial. And it’s so vibey in the water. And I know how to handle myself in the water, but I’m no local.
And I recognize guys in the water and they recognize me, but like, I, it’s, it can be an intimidating vibe and it’s just kind of like surly out there. Paddle out at Uncial, that’s where my kids like really learned to love to surf. And like people are smiling in the water.
It’s so nice. It’s such a, it’s such a cool community. People like actually know each other and, and are happy to see each other.
It’s really cool.
Hindsight Lessons: What to Do Differently
[Richard Bexon]
Well, I mean, it’s been a ride and a leisure project, you know, and I’m sure you’ve learned a few things, but I mean, if you could go back to the beginning and tell yourself something, what would it be?
[Dave Matt]
Okay. Yeah. I would say raise more money.
Yep. And I mean, maybe find a developer who, who wouldn’t say that. So maybe that’s not all that helpful, but I mean, talk is cheap, money buys the whiskey.
So like get, get more money or at least get more money than what I started with. And then honestly, I’d say not that everything up until this point was dishonestly, but honestly, I would say simplify and, and, and like maybe sell lots instead of, instead of pre-selling villas. And I didn’t have that, didn’t really have that foresight, I guess you could say, I mean, now it’s hindsight, right?
That’s the, that’s the game we’re playing. So yeah, it’s, it’s the Aletheia project is untraditional in that the aim has not been to make money. It might sound strange on an investment podcast, but the aim has been, and will continue to be to do something good, but it’s not like do something well.
Yes, do it, do something well, but do something good. Like we actually want to do good for the community and for the investors, for the, for people. And maybe that’s, and that is, that complicates things because it’s not a language that everyone speaks.
And you know, it, it is, it might not be the recipe for success, but that’s the recipe for, I guess, personal aspirations, I suppose.
Costa Rica Development Challenges
[Richard Bexon]
Yeah. I mean, look, you and I have talked about before of like, Costa Rica is just not easy. Like if you want to make a quick buck, this is not the country.
And even selling lots, you know, it’s not a quick buck sometimes either. And just the amount of time and money and planning that has to go in just for infrastructure or getting permits, you know, people just sometimes understand either. And I mean, we did a previous podcast, a couple of episodes, but which actually is about to come out with Luis Fernando Rojas, who has a consulting group up there on developing, you know, condominiums.
And he’s like, look, sometimes it can take years, you know, and yeah. And, you know, I mean, it’s, yeah, I believe it. What were the things that you couldn’t see, you know, when you kind of, you first started?
I mean, maybe a similar question, what I just asked, but like, yeah. Yeah, no, it’s kind of cousin questions, I guess.
Partnership Failures and Their Impact
[Dave Matt]
They, forgive me if this sounds a little naive and like, I’m an attorney by day. I’m a general counsel for a software company in North Idaho. So this was my first foray into developing my, you know, prior to working as an attorney, I was an entrepreneur in the software industry.
And so I’ve done a lot of, I’ve done a lot of deals and I’ve built several companies. And so this actually does sound naive. What I didn’t see, like the corners that I couldn’t look around were the prospective partnerships that were like, they were coming together.
I thought they were like good. I thought they were in place and they fell apart. And that is, it’s been hard for us to recover from one partnership in particular.
It was like, we had a construction partner and it did not happen. And it took a lot of time to build that partnership to the place where it was go time and go time was like, it didn’t arrive.
[Richard Bexon]
Yeah.
[Dave Matt]
That hurt. That hurt quite a bit.
Construction Company Formation
[Richard Bexon]
Construction is just so difficult in this country, just in general, as you know. And yeah, I mean, look, I’ve just started a construction company myself just because that’s where I got to where I was like, you know what, screw it. Everyone move out the way we’re going to do.
Yeah. Well, I wouldn’t say that. It’s just, I mean, we ended up doing it anyway.
So, you know, we did it now on Antonio. So I was like, well, why would we not just do it? And my head of construction engineering, I was like, he was like, dude, I want to do this.
I was like, okay, we can partner, but I want to be clear if you’re running the show, like I will run the back end of it, bring the projects in, we’ll develop them, et cetera. But like you need to be the boots on the ground. So you need your engineer, you need your maestro, all of us, you know, you need your team and bring one of the project managers of our team, you know, kind of onto it.
But, but yeah, it’s.
[Dave Matt]
Honestly, I’ve, you’re not the first person I’ve heard say this or like they’ve done projects a number of times to the point where they were like, forget it. I’m, I am going to start a construction company so I can have more control over the timeline, more control over the cost, more control over the cash flow. Like just, yeah.
And Lou, I listened to your podcast that was recently released about the things you’ve learned about developing. You were getting into some of the details that I wish I were able to discuss with you about the nightmares of construction and the, you know, infrastructure costing double what was planned and et cetera, et cetera. We, we have engineering plans, we have Villa house blueprints.
We have, you know, we have all these, but we have not broken ground. So I, I do not have those, those horror stories to, to connect with you over. And I, oh God knows I, I wish I did.
The Journey vs. The Destination
[Richard Bexon]
But I mean, you know, I mean, the beauty of it is the journey, to be honest with you. And I mean, you know, as I get older, one of my buddies the other day wrote a LinkedIn podcast and he was like, you know, he’s just turned 50 and he was like, what would I tell my 30 year old self? You know, it’s like, it’s about the journey, dude.
Like don’t go chasing the money. Like it will come just do great work and work hard and money will come. So don’t focus on that.
[Dave Matt]
So I think another way of saying that is that the means and the end may not be two distinct things. The means and the end might be one in the same. Yeah.
And that’s like, that’s a, I, I haven’t always been tuned into that. And now today, like 2025, like now more than ever, it’s important that we act and behave with character and with truth and with honesty and that we open our eyes to the beauty that’s around us, to the relationships that are around us. And we like take stock that there is more than just ROI at stake.
Like these are our, get off my soapbox in a second, but like the means and the end, if you’re a creep, but you make money for your investors at the end of the day, like I say you, you have lost and you have cost your investors something bigger than just like making the money like that. Now, look, do I want to make the early birds who got in on Aletheia? Do I want to make them money with every cell in my body at what cost?
Well, I’m going to tell the truth and I’m going to, I’m going to shoot you straight and I’m going to shoot everyone else straight. So.
Mission-Driven Development Philosophy
[Richard Bexon]
Yeah. I mean, yeah, I completely agree. You know, I mean, it’s, I try not to chase the dollars here in Costa Rica because, you know, my mission is bigger, which is to kind of chase the, change the, the face of tourism in Costa Rica.
If you like, you know, do this quickly of there’s a lot of vacation rentals out there. Okay. Tons of them.
They’re all on Airbnb, but they’re not really managed that well sometimes. And like, you know, anyway, they have security issues and all this kind of stuff. On the other side, you have hotels today.
You can’t build boutique hotels, which is the essence of this country. You know, the essential Costa Rica, the no artificial ingredients, the Puerto Vida is the small boutique culturalness of this country. Problem is the numbers don’t work today.
It’s too expensive. Costa Rica is too expensive to do a boutique hotel unless you’re charging 1500 bucks a night, 2000, but then you’re competing on a different level and Costa Rica, you know, maybe can, you know, bring that amount in. But anyway, so I might look, I’m trying to build those boutique hotels through villa development, you know, where individual owners can own these properties or they get fractionalized.
But I also include breakfast on-site concierge check-ins. Like it’s a world where I’m not, I don’t have the expense of a hotel, but I have the services and I’m not like, just here’s the keys. And there it is.
It’s like, no, no, no. You get checked in and there are cold, you know, hand towels when you check in drinks and stuff like, you know, yeah. So, yeah.
[Dave Matt]
Well, I like it when you agree with me completely. And so right back at you, I agree with you completely. That is a, that’s a very timely model to have in the market right now.
Well, absolutely.
[Richard Bexon]
And we’ll see, you know, I mean, so far so good. So, but yeah, my hotel friends are like, they didn’t like it to begin with. And now they’re like, okay, rich, like how do we do this together?
[Dave Matt]
Well, I think if, if you can’t do it, I don’t know. I don’t know who can. So Richard, I don’t know.
So yeah. And I think it’s going to work. I think you’re already seeing, seeing the signs that, that there’s resonance.
So definitely.
Investor Mindset for Costa Rica Development
[Richard Bexon]
What do you think investors in Costa Rica need to understand about like, you know, investing in, I suppose, developing here? I mean, I think you mentioned something earlier, which is raise more money, have more money, of course, if you’re going to develop.
[Dave Matt]
Sure. I, I think that, you know, I’ll say with, with, with the folks who, who got in with Aletheia in the early days, like, like, God blessed them, literally God bless them. They have been so willing to allow the project to breathe and evolve.
And they came in with the right mindset that like, okay, this is in its infancy, and it is going to adapt to the opportunities and to the challenges. And so I think if, you know, if you’re investing into a development, I would, I would encourage you to have a little spirit of adventure, like embrace that side of yourself. And the reward can be tremendous.
Like, allow, allow the project, the wiggle room to evolve and improve, because typically what, what we saw in, in how our master plan had evolved, it just kept getting better. Now, in terms of design and, and direction. Now, in our, in our case, the, the vision, the original core vision got away from us, and the project got too big.
And there probably, I could probably, you know, talk with you on a whole other podcast about how that happened and why and, and what I would do differently there. However, the principle here that I’m trying to relay is that, like, if you can allow a project to breathe and evolve, and if it’s, if it’s properly financed, I think that there is, with that movement, with that agility, that’s afforded the project, it’s, but go in knowing that it’s going to take its, take its turns, and it’s going to have to navigate some twists. Would you agree?
I mean, you’re, you’re sitting in a, you know, you got three built and another three underway.
[Richard Bexon]
I look at it like this. The hard thing about hard things is they’re so like, hard stuff’s gonna happen, and you just have to kind of roll with it. And did I invest more in infrastructure than I wanted to?
Yeah. Could I have made more money if I’d have been cheap? Yeah.
But I’m like, for me, everything I do is a reflection of me, because the only thing I have is my brand. So it’s like, people go, oh, I belong in Costa Rica, and it’s like, and, you know, in Costa Rica investments, and it’s like, well, that’s Richard. You know, so everything I do has to kind of be a reflection of me, because I’m here for life.
You know, I’ve been here for 20 years. I’m here for the rest of my life. So I want to make sure I have a good reputation.
Building the Right Team
Yeah. Yeah, that’s understandable. Well, um, Dave, I mean, how do you make sure, you know, from an investments that sorry, I’m just sitting here looking at like, 50 monkeys in the tree in front of me, it’s just, you know, but anyway, um, how do you make sure that you have like good advisors on this stuff when you first start?
Because again, it’s like, yeah, I mean, yeah, but your advice on, you know, putting the team together?
[Dave Matt]
Yeah, team is critical. And I’d say there are, in my experience, the team was, like, it includes your, your, like, white collar folks who are maybe sitting behind a computer, like your legal team, maybe like your, your, your architect and your engineers and, and then like, all the way across the spectrum to your groundskeeper, like, the everything really works together to, like, if one thing is off, the whole, the whole, the whole thing gets thrown on.
So people are, I mean, these are, these are human endeavors we’re engaging in, even if we’re like, moving dirt, and, you know, and, you know, swinging a hammer. So I would say there’s a tremendous need for any project and any developer to have leadership, very clear, strong, informed leadership on the project management side.
[Richard Bexon]
Yeah.
[Dave Matt]
And there’s, I think it’s important for the developer to have a vision and to have them and to, like, almost be like a, to an extent, like a jack of all trades, but to have a clear project management, outsourced to your company or outsourced to another company that can provide that go between with technical issues with respect to the legal, legal issues when they, when they start to have implications on like, where does the road go?
And does the road meet the property line, whatever, you know, those little techniques that takes so much time to the substantive issues around, like, is this water discharge engineering flow actually going to work given the contours and the topography of the land? Like, so having strong leadership on a project management side is, is imperative, imperative. And I think having some enthusiasm, I mean, straight up, if you don’t love what you’re doing, man, I don’t know how people would do it.
I don’t know how projects would get finished.
Navigating Municipal Complexity
[Richard Bexon]
And even more here, just because, again, as you said, it’s not a straight line. There is no clear process sometimes. Or they’d say that.
Oh, totally. Yeah. Yeah.
[Dave Matt]
I was talking to another developer who, you know, he, the international company, they have developments over elsewhere. And when, when they first arrived, they were, they were encountering some permitting issues. And there was a disconnect between the architectural blueprint plans and what the permitting would allow.
And his initial reaction was, and his initial perspective was, like, people, people kind of suck on the architectural design side. Like, they don’t know what they’re doing. They’re creating these plans that don’t work.
Well, he comes to, like, his son’s come full circle. And he’s like, actually, nobody knows what they’re doing. And the architects are doing their best.
And then you go to municipality, they’re doing their best to interpret the regulations. And where the two collide, there’s just, like, mass inefficiency.
[Richard Bexon]
Well, and I think it comes back to what you said there, which is project manager, project manager, then pulls everyone into a room or goes to the local municipality. Like, I’ve been there, man, like here in memory of the municipality was like, hey, you know, you need a centenna D one certificate because you’re moving over 1000 square meters of dirt. And we were like, well, we’re not like, and we had to explain it to her that cubic meters is not the same as square meters.
And anyway, and like, that’s what that makes sense. And so then the architects had to go back and change stuff, and then resubmit it in order for her to do it. And then once it was done the way that she wanted, she just like literally two seconds, bang approved.
There you go. The architect is not going to talk to the engineer in the like, they are separate worlds. And architects and engineers sometimes don’t talk to each other in the same language.
[Dave Matt]
Oh, no doubt. I mean, yeah, no doubt. It’s it’s kind of like the design and marketing team, back in my clothing production days.
And, you know, the production managing team, they’re aiming at two different targets, two different definitions of success, actually, two different sides of the brain.
[Richard Bexon]
A lot of times.
[Dave Matt]
Oh, for sure. You know?
Aletheia Project Future and Sale Details
[Richard Bexon]
So yeah, well, I mean, what’s the future for the Lethar project? I’m so glad you asked, Richard.
[Dave Matt]
The future of the Lethar project, we have the property up for sale. It’s 51,000 square meters with 13 acres. It’s titled Beachfront on the beach.
I think you described it. Go back and listen to the first podcast. It was about two years ago right now.
I believe you described it as a gold gem. I mean, I have to double check.
[Richard Bexon]
It’s a stunning. Look, there’s not that much title Beachfront property in Costa Rica. It’s a large piece of land.
It has good infrastructure. It’s in Junquiao. Like, I mean, I think for any developer, any person wanting a private home, any one person wanted to do a hotel or anything like that, you know, in Junquiao, it has great infrastructure.
That’s what I love about Junquiao. Great infrastructure.
[Dave Matt]
Yeah, we’re paved road from Liberia to the front driveway. It’s incredible. So yeah, it’s 13 acres.
It’s titled it’s on the beach. It is stunning. Absolutely gorgeous.
Reminds me a little bit of Montecito because it has the rolling hills and then all these palm trees. It’s like there is no property like it anywhere, anywhere. It is that beautiful.
So we have the property up for sale for $3.5 million. We also have an opportunity to join in a shareholder capacity by taking a majority interest. And that opportunity is at $2.5 million. And with that, with that project, so basically we have two master plans, one to develop, take property into your own hands, and take on the 20 villa master plan that was created. So buy the land and the property outright and you also get the project. Join as a partner in the corporation and take a majority position at $2.5 million and do some very, very light infrastructure and segregation of the land into nine lots. And there is significant ROI on that nine lot master plan, as I call it. Significant. So it’s a buyer’s market.
So it’s time to show up with cash in hand and be the beneficiary of one of the only title beachfront piece of property in the nation.
Investment Question
[Richard Bexon]
Well, I have no doubt that someone will definitely snap it up as well, because again, it’s, you know, I believe in Pinky Owl long-term, it’s kind of like Avianas and its development front. Again, better because the asphalt road and get to it very quickly and again, better infrastructure as well. But question for you, Davis, I’ve kept you long enough.
If you had $500,000 and you had to invest it into a business or real estate in Costa Rica, what would you invest it in and why?
[Dave Matt]
Without a doubt, I would take that half a million bucks and I would buy myself a lot on the Aletheia property in Pinky Owl. Honest to God, there is no better value than buying land in Pinky Owl. There’s no better value in the entire country.
It is that pristine and beautiful and rare. So without hesitation, and perhaps that’s self-serving, but so be it. That’s why we did it in the first place is because it is the best beach in Costa Rica.
[Richard Bexon]
Awesome. Well, Dave, an absolute pleasure to have you come here on the podcast and share your experience with us. And again, I’ll put all the descriptions and contact details down below, but very much appreciate you taking the time to chat with us today.
Yeah, it’s good to see you.
[Dave Matt]
You look good. Are you losing weight or what’s happening here?
[Richard Bexon]
Yeah, I’ve lost a bit of weight, man. I was going to say your Tom Selleck mustache is hung over there, dude.
[Dave Matt]
One day I’ll tell you a story about Tom Selleck. I’ve met the guy.
[Richard Bexon]
But no, I think I lost like 10 pounds during the whole process of the last month here in August.
[Dave Matt]
Yeah, waking up at 4am can have its effects, huh? You know, dude, I’m sure you’ve had a few of them. Months and months and months on end.
Well, I appreciate it.
[Richard Bexon]
We’ll get you on again in the future and maybe go down the development you know, yeah, rabbit hole.
[Dave Matt]
Right on. You never walk alone, Richard. Go Liverpool.
Don’t walk alone.
[Richard Bexon]
That’s it, dude. Have a good one.
[Dave Matt]
All right. Take care.
[Richard Bexon]
Bye.
